This oral history was collected and edited by the George Ewart Evans Centre for Storytelling as part of the Bawso Stories project.

The Bawso Stories project is an innovative partnership project between George Ewart Evans Centre for Storytelling (University of South Wales), specialist support organisation Bawso and National Museum Wales. This project was funded by National Lottery Heritage Fund.

Consent has been given for this story to be shared
a. In the archives and collections of Amgueddfa Cymru (Museum Wales) 
b. On websites, e.g. The People’s Collection Wales, Bawso, The University of South Wales, Amgueddfa Cymru, etc. 
c. On social media, e.g. Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, etc. 
d. In written publications, e.g. project reports, journal articles, etc. 
e. In any other uses in line with the project aims and objectives

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Interview with Wole (Bawso Stories)

Duration: 00:26:20

My first question is, would you like to tell me something about your experience of coming to Wales?

Okay, let me start from when I came to the UK.  I'm Nigerian, I'm a Christian. I came to UK as a student, and I won't call my child a mistake but I gave birth at the age of 23 as a student, and from the high upper hands, my school was being suspended, so I was given two options, go back home or seek an asylum. So, I choose to seek an asylum because of my son and my life. So, coming down to being seeking an asylum, I was moved from England down to Wales, it was, it was not a nice experience. It was not a nice experience because being a first-time mom and a single mom with no family or friend support, it was a nightmare. My son fell ill at two months, was in hospital with no reason for sickness or anything.  First there was no support system. Then, because of my health was deteriorating, so I was having clot and a lot of sickness like that. So I have some along the line, I got some support. I have some people supporting me, so they monitor my anger, my depression, and everything.  It happened a couple of time and couple of times I just want to be I don't want people around. I just want to be alone, just only with my son. My anger issue escalated since it started affecting my son, but with the help of the support I have around me and some advice, I was able to overcome it. So, they make me understand that if you have support system, you can actually cope you don't need to isolate yourself. You just need to make the right move and visit the right places at the right time. I know there was a time I came to Bawso and there was they gave a few tips from the program they did, I can remember. I can remember the time. They gave some advice and going back home, and I kind of think back to what they said to some words, some of the women and mothers give them it. It helped me build who I am today, to be a strong lady I am today, which kind of helpful. It’s not bad. You just need to follow the right pattern and the gathering that you are being invited to, because you don't know, you might be lucky to meet the right people that will direct you in the right place.

Excellent. And what were your impressions of when you got here?

Oh, no relatives or anything it was… I didn't really force because the court … but come to later on, I become… It become a home. So now I'm advising most of my friends that it will be nice if you can move, because there's no racism. You don't go out and feel scared and all those things. So it is beautiful. Let me use that word.

That's really lovely. And what, so when you say it's your home, what does that word mean to you? Home.

I feel peace. My child is my number one priority in my life, it's me home because my son is being safe. He's not being scared of going out, being socialised. No, matter the time and when, he is not being threatened by the forces and… How can I use it? I don't want to use a strong word, but I'm looking for…. from nasty people. Let me use the word nasty because, let me explain more in details, because…. I've travelled to some places in UK, generally, especially London and Birmingham.  I'm not going to be happy if they ask me anything there. It's not where I want my child to grow up with, because there's a lot of crime scene there. So you hardly hear of any crime. So is a peaceful place to be, because it's safe for your kids. And people are friendly. I know that it is. So, yeah.

That's really good to hear. Is there you talked about people being friendly and feeling safe? Is there a particular memory you've got somebody along the way where there's an example of.

Okay, I’ve been to couple of some, charity places, and it helped. I've been to the African Community. They help, that's why I said they are nice. They have mixtures of different people there, charity, even though I didn't from anybody there. My friend just said, “oh, they have this. Oh, just put me there”. They don't see me. But when I need help and I call them, they always there to help. So that's why I said, it’s good.

Thank you. So, the next question I've got is, can you describe a place or a time in your life that's important to you? It could be any time or place you choose. Is there somewhere you would like to talk about, an event or a place or a time that you would like to say.

Time or place, a lot has happened in my life that I really don't even know. Don't want to choose.

Yeah, it can be a happy thing.

Happy thing.

If you can choose. You know, it's up to you what you would like to tell us.

I really don't know about that aspect, happy place. Where did I have? Okay, yeah. During the lockdown, I’d kind of say it's my happy moment, because during the lockdown, that was when I know I have people that care for me a lot. I was being introduced to ….  She's wonderful, she's she…. During the lockdown, she made me know that, in the midst of crisis, in the midst of your down time, there's always people to rely on. So she, I was really depressed during that period, because my son is still little, so he always want to go out and all those things. Despite the restriction and everything, she makes sure that once in a while, she will pop down to, to check on us, and she take us out and make us have a nice places I have not been so that it's just, I can't, I don't know the word to use for it. It's just, it was an awesome period for me, that moment. It was awesome. So, yeah, those are my wonderful times.

Do you want to tell me about the place she took you?

I don’t know the names, that’s the problem.

You don’t need to use names, tell me what they were like.

Oh she took us to that was the first time I went to this beach in…. It was nice there. So she took us around there, and it was just the experience there was totally different. I felt a lot of things being lift off of my shoulder. So, she took us out. Especially my son. She took my son to this, this play creche. She took them to that even though there was restriction to how many people that can get in, I didn't go in and see what they were doing there, because they have limits of people. So it was only allowed with one adult to go in there. So, she goes in there.  When they were coming out, the expression on their faces was, it was really amazing, because they've been indoor, indoor for months and months, so for them to go out for the first time after few months was like a really, really wonderful thing. So, she took us, what was the name of this place?  She took she took us to a lot of places. I can't even remember their names. Well, it was a nice experience for us. There are many in Wales. What is the name of this? But they are Welsh name. I can't even pronounce it. That's the problem.

That’s OK. You don’t need to pronounce it. You went to a beach as well.

Yeah, we went to beach. Yeah, but because the weather was really strong, so I didn't go inside the water, but I'm watching it. I can’t pronounce it. What's the name of the beach? But the waves, the way, the way the water was moving. It's, some, its too [kissing noise]. So that one, actually the water so clearly. What's the name of this beach? I forgot the name. So the water was really beautiful. It was really, really beautiful. It was, it was so clear. And it's, it was a nice environment. I can't remember their names.

It doesn't matter. And, and you said the water was really clear?

Yeah, it was really clear that. I was wondering, because nobody has come up and swim in the water for a long time. So it was, was really clear. And the cool breeze, the sea, the salty water, it's, it's bring. How can I? it, it… I felt the kind of sensation that I normally do not feel. So I felt calm. I'm not really, I don't like going to the water. It was like a really cool moment for me that I feel peace. That’s it.

I love the sea too, really love the sea.  So would you like to tell me, so we talked about the places you go to know to feel at home. Is there a place from childhood that feels like home that you'd like to tell me about?

A place from my childhood I feel like home? Do I? I don’t actually think much of my childhood anymore because I have grown up. But yeah, my childhood place, I will have to go back to when I was in Lagos, because then, oh yeah, I know. Oh… I miss when I was in Lagos, because I was living with my uncle. I was being spoilt.  I was being really, really pampered. And I miss my childhood. Let me use that word so that like I say, I miss my childhood because….  It was beautiful time for me that. I, now, I'm missing him more because my uncle is late. He died last year but I miss my childhood, and I miss my childhood in Lagos, not any other place, that's all.

And your uncle was a very important person for you.

Yeah, he trained me. He made me, I was able to able to communicate properly well in English now, and able to write was because of my uncle, because I live with him from a very little age. He trained me to… I was able to go to secondary school. So, yeah, it's, that's my second dad. So yeah.

And what was the place like you lived in with your uncle?

Oh, it's a beautiful memory with my uncle and his wife and my aunty. It's something I would love to live again. Yeah.

If I was to go there, what would I see?

Oh, if you go there, a lot of things. They call Lagos “Small London”, because it's almost as crowded as London. But there are some places that are estates which we live in, the estate is secure around Lagos. So, so, living with my uncle then, and able to grow up in an environment that was being named as one of the notorious cities.  It was still…. I didn’t experience the notorious side of it. I experience the enjoyable, the peaceful, the calm environment to grow up with, not like nowadays. Now that, nah, it's not something I want to. But if I need to go back to the past, I want to live that life again. Because I was, I have a lot of freedom. I was able to explore a lot of things, and I was able to play with my mates and all those things. So yeah.

And is that something you see with your own children in …

Yeah, now with my son, he’s even more advanced than before, because now my son has more advantage than when I was growing up. Because even when I have a joyful childhood and upbringing, but now my son have more privilege than I do, especially when it comes to the school aspect of it. Back home, you need to pay for your school fees and everything, but here, the government provide everything for them, which is really good advantages for me and the environment my son is being brought up, it's more advanced and more educational than before. So, yeah, my son have more advantages than, which I'm happy about.

So you’ve talked a little bit about this, but we, in this project, we've been looking at magic moments, so moments when something changed or transformed, and it felt magical and wonderful. When something's different for you.

Oh something different. Okay, I think something different for me, started when I discovered I was pregnant, yeah, because I wasn't planning to have a child at 23 so my son came like a miracle. It came like a big blow from out of the blue. So experiencing child, experiencing pregnancy, from pregnancy. Then the big moment came when I had him. That was when I know this is a responsibility, that it's something I can. I was being advised then to get rid of the child, to give him up for adoption. But I was like: “no, I'd rather give up my education than giving up on him”, because he made me believe I can do it, even when everyone was telling me “no you can't”. So, that's kind of a big magical to me, because being a mother is not everybody that has a child that can call themselves a mother. It's how you bring up your child, it's how you give them the life they want that made you a mother and the foundation you leave for them. That's what made you a mother.

And what foundation do you want to leave for your child?

For my child, for my child and children, I want them to know that everything is not rosy. You need to work for it, you need to be truthful to yourself, to your society. You need to be God fearing. You need to know that no matter every step you take in this life, there's a maker that is monitoring you. And you need to believe that with God, all things are possible, despite facing the ups and downs, despite facing the challenges of life. But if you trust in God and you put your faith in him, everything will work out perfectly good.

You’ve known that since the moment you first held your child. Or is that something you've come to over time?

The truth is, when I was pregnant, I really didn't know. I was being forced to go to church. I was kind of the black sheep of the house, so I was being forced to get into church. But when I came to UK, I was thinking that “ah, everything will be fine. You have to live”. But when I had my child, then I noticed, now you need to buckle up. You need to be focused. You need to depend on God to make a move, because there are some decision you take on your own that it's back firing, really bad on you. But if you put God first in everything you do, it will definitely lead you in the right path. So, like now I always tell my son, before you go to bed, before you as you're going to bed, you tell God: “guide me, protect me”. He does say his prayer every night. And when he may wake up sometime he doesn't forget, but remember when he's having breakfast, or he’ll remember when he's about to leave the house, he will start thanking God and start praying along the way that God should take control of the day. So I make sure before you do anything, you put God first in everything you do. So I knew about that when I had my son. I knew, but I never take it serious, but until I had him. So yeah.

Do you want to tell me about the first, when you met your son, when you held him?  

Oh yeah.

You’ve got two sons haven’t you?

Just one.

It is just one.

That’s my friend’s son.

Oh.

Because I’m his god mother, so he’s with me most of the time.

Oh.

My son is seven now, the first time I held him. I could not describe the joy I was feeling because putting the tiny little thing in your hand and just imagine how you can give up this beautiful angel is something I could not.  Holding him for the first time was, ah, it's beautiful, because the first time I hold him, I didn't use any word. I was just crying. So till now, if I have been asked that question over and over, how do you feel that day? I felt really, really overwhelmed. So I could not explain it. I can just raise the word overwhelmed.  I was really, really overwhelmed on the first day I hold him, so yeah.

That was really beautiful.  Yeah. It is that overwhelm, isn’t it? It's beyond words. You don't have words; you don't have language. Just emotion. Yeah.

Just emotions.

Same for me. So, we've talked a bit about the things that have brought you to this point where you are now on this day. If you imagine the future, what are your hopes or what do you imagine the future to look like for you?

For me? What do I imagine my future to be like?

Or hope.

I imagine myself, let me put it in the next five years. I want to be an entrepreneurship. I want to have my own business. I want to able to do my things myself. So that should be at the age of 36 I should be able to have a complete some certain things in my life. So, I want my future to be okay when I look at it five years from now, say, “Ah, I've come this far with the support of a lot of people and God”, so I hope my future and the next five years to be awesome. I want it to be awesome. So, yeah.

So would you, I don't know if you want to talk about this, we've focused on what's brought you here from a really, really positive point, is there something? Is there a moment where you feel you overcame something, or you’re proud of yourself for how you got through something that was difficult, that you'd like to talk about?

That was when I was being disowned by my dad. Yeah, that moment was, that was my down time, and me overcoming it was, was being around positive people a lot, which I have a lot of positive people in my life. Overcoming it now and able to talk to him again, feel, feeling beautiful. Because I'm always my daddy’s girl, so being disowned by him was a big blow to me. So yeah, I'm happy that I overcome it. Let's say, it's like, when he was not there, it was like part of me was gone. That's why I have my son with me then, but I still feel I'm not complete. So having him back, it’s just beautiful.

Thank you, is there anything that you want to talk about that we, that I haven't asked you about. So, if you think about who you are and how you want to what you want to say about yourself to the world.

About myself to the world…. I am a strong lady that's overcome depression and when you have been depressed, the only thing I'll tell you to be aware of is your environment. Your environment means a lot when you have been down. Because I remember when I was being down, I was being depressed, that I've tried to commit suicide couple of times, and being supported by a lot of people, by a lot of, by some organisations, helped me know that okay, when you are down, think about the future. Think about what will happen to your loved ones, that people that care about you genuinely and with every vibes, and then they care about you, think about those people before you make some decision. Because I was happy and I'm grateful to God, that's when I was being down, when I was being depressed, I tried to take some decision, that if I have taken those decision, maybe if I'm not even here anymore today, it was something I would regret. But I'm thankful for God that trying to take those decision then, and I see people to stop me, and I think about some positive things in my life make me push forward. So always surround yourself with positivities, not negativities and keep yourself in a company of good vibes. So, yeah.

That's fantastic. Thank you. Have you had a chance to say everything you want to say about.

That’s all I can think about, because there are some things and I have to keep because if I reveal it, I'll be emotional, which I don't want to anymore.

Yeah, yeah.

They’re like a burden I'm trying to get rid of, but it's tough. But yeah.

That's great. Thank you so much. Thank you.